February 15, 1969
MRS. MARY MOORMAN, a witness for the State, after first being duly sworn by the Minute Clerk, was examined and testified on her oath as follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. ALFORD:
Q: State your full name, please.
A: Mary H. Moorman.
Q: Mrs. Moorman, it is very important for everyone to hear you so if you will speak into the microphone everyone will be able to hear. If you don't understand any question I ask or Defense Counsel asks, please ask us to repeat it. Mrs. Moorman, where do you reside?
A: Dallas, Texas.
Q: Did you reside in Dallas, Texas on November 22, 1963?
A: Yes, sir, I did.
Q: Mrs. Moorman, did you have occasion to be in Dealey Plaza on November 22, 1963?
A: Yes, sir, I did.
Q: I would ask that you step down from the witness chair, Mrs. Moorman, step over here please, Mrs. Moorman, and I show you what for purposes of identification is marked State 34 and I ask you whether or not you recognize the photograph depicted in here?
A: Yes, I do.
Q: What is this a photograph of?
A: Dealey Plaza.
Q: Now, Mrs. Moorman, I direct your attention to what has been marked State 35 and I give you a small flag with your name on it and request that you please pin this flag on the location, your location, in Dealey Plaza on November 22, 1963. Mrs. Moorman, at the time you were in Dealey Plaza what scene was directly across from you if you recall?
A: The pagoda and stairs going up.
Q: Mrs. Moorman, have you placed yourself in the proper location?
A: As far as I can determine.
Q: Mrs. Moorman, I also show you and direct your attention to what has been previously marked as State 36, which is a markup of Dealey Plaza and I give you this small emblem and request that you place this in approximately your location in Dealey Plaza. Now, Mrs. Moorman, have you placed yourself here on the same side of the street as on this large plot?
A: Yes.
Q: Now, Mrs. Moorman, approximately what time did you arrive on November 22 at Dealey Plaza?
A: Around 11:00.
Q: And were you accompanied by anyone?
A: Yes.
Q: By whom were you accompanied?
A: A friend [Jean Hill].
Q: Now did you have occasion while in Dealey Plaza to observe the Presidential motorcade?
A: Yes, I did.
Q: And at -- upon which street was the motorcade at the time you first observed it?
A: Elm Street.
Q: And in what direction was it proceeding, I don't mean north or so but if you can identify the direction in relationship to real estate?
A: It is to my right coming towards me.
Q: Now did anything unusual occur in Dealey Plaza on November 22?
A: Yes.
Q: Would you please explain to the Gentlemen of the Jury exactly what you saw and heard on November 22.
A: I observed the motorcade as it approached. There were several cars preceding the Presidential limousine and as the Presidential limousine approached me I stepped forward to observe closer in order to take a picture, that is what I planned to do and just what I did.
Q: Did you hear any unusual noises?
A: Yes.
Q: And what did these noises -- How many of these noises did you hear and what did it sound like to you?
A: I heard three noises and they sounded like firecrackers.
Q: Mrs. Moorman, what type -- you stated you had a camera in your possession and please tell us what type of camera?
A: This is an earlier model Polaroid.
Q: Did you take any photographs?
A: Yes, I did.
Q: Mrs. Moorman, do you presently have in your possession a photograph?
A: Yes, I do.
Q: And when was this photograph taken?
A: As the Presidential limousine drew across from me.
Q: Did -- and would you please hand me the photograph?
MR. ALFORD: What is the next number?
THE MINUTE CLERK: Fifty.
MR. DYMOND: Your Honor please, we object to this witness' testimony on the ground that it is irrelevant to the issues in this case.
THE COURT: The objection is overruled.
MR. DYMOND: To which ruling Counsel reserves a bill of exception making the objection, the testimony of this witness and all the testimony at this point and the reason for the objection and the Court's ruling part of the bill.
BY MR. ALFORD:
Q: Now, Mrs. Moorman, in relation to the photograph you have just handed me and which I have marked State 50, I would ask you to look at this photograph and tell the Gentlemen of the Jury and the Court whether or not the photograph is in the condition it was in at a short period of time after it was taken?
A: No, it is not.
Q: How does this condition now differ from then?
A: It has lightened in color which is due to the film but it also has fingerprints on it.
Q: Mrs. Moorman, how long after you took this photograph did you first see it?
A: Probably a minute or just minutes.
Q: And do you at this time identify this photograph as a photograph you took of the President?
MR. DYMOND: Objection to the leading of the witness.
BY MR. ALFORD:
Q: Where was this photograph taken?
A: In Dealey Plaza.
Q: And did you take it?
A: Yes, sir, I did.
Q: Now, Mrs. Moorman, I show you what for purposes of identification I have marked State 52, however prior to showing you this exhibit I would ask you what happened if anything to your photograph after you took it.
A: Immediately after taking this photograph there was a matter of confusion and I did cross the street and a man came up to me and asked me if I --
MR. DYMOND: Object to anything a man may have said.
THE COURT: Don't tell us what anyone told you but you may tell us what you did.
THE WITNESS: I was asked to remove --
MR. DYMOND: I object to what was asked, Your Honor.
THE COURT: It is a good objection. Someone said something to you and what did you do as a result of what the person said to you?
THE WITNESS: I removed the picture out of the camera.
BY MR. ALFORD:
Q: What did you do then with the picture?
A: I looked at it.
Q: Did this photograph remain in your possession from the time you took it until today?
A: No, it did not.
Q: Whose possession other than yourself has this photograph been?
A: A reporter and the Secret Service and the FBI that I know of.
Q: Mrs. Moorman, I now show you what for purposes of identification has been marked as State 52 and ask you to inspect this, please. What is this a photograph of, Mrs. Moorman?
A: Well --
MR. DYMOND: I object because I think the photograph speaks for itself rather than have the witness interpret the photograph.
THE COURT: I do not believe she can go into describing the details of what it is.
BY MR. ALFORD:
Q: Can you identify what is contained in this photograph?
A: Yes.
Q: And what is it?
A: It is a picture of the picture that I took.
Q: Can you see the picture clearly?
MR. DYMOND: I object to the leading.
BY MR. ALFORD:
Q: Is there any doubt in your mind as to whether or not this is a picture --
MR. DYMOND: I object to leading again.
THE COURT: It is the way you form your questions, Mr. Alford. Rephrase and ask her what it is.
BY MR. ALFORD:
Q: Once again explain to us what it is.
A: This is a picture of the photograph that I took.
Q: Now, Mrs. Moorman, I show you what for purposes of identification has been marked State 51 and ask you to inspect this. Can you identify what is depicted here?
A: Yes.
Q: What is it?
A: It is a portion of the photograph.
Q: Of what photograph?
A: The photograph of mine.
Q: Is there anything contained in State 51 which is not contained in your photograph?
A: Yes, there is a difference in these two photographs if that is what you're asking me.
Q: What is the difference?
A: In my photograph it shows two motorcycle policemen while this only has a portion of one.
Q: Is everything that is contained in State 51 also contained in your photograph?
A: Yes.
Q: Mrs. Moorman, what was the color of your dress on November 22?
A: A blue raincoat, navy blue.
Q: Mrs. Moorman, I now show you what for purposes of identification has been previously marked as State 41 and I would request you to look at this photograph and identify yourself if you can. Would you please write your name under the --
THE COURT: Not her name, her initials. Put an "M" for Moorman.
MR. ALFORD: Your initials.
THE WITNESS: (The witness complies.)
BY MR. ALFORD:
Q Does this represent your approximate location at the time you took the photograph?
A: Approximately, yes.
Q: All right.
MR. ALFORD: May it please the Court, at this time the State would request permission to show the Zapruder film to this witness for the purpose of identifying herself in this film if she is able to do so.
MR. DYMOND: I object because I don't think there is any necessity to show it and reshow this film. The lady has identified herself in still pictures and fixes the location of her person when she took this photograph. I don't see any reason to rerun the film.
THE COURT: The objection is overruled.
MR. DYMOND: To which ruling Counsel again objects on the grounds it is unnecessary and prejudicial matter by repeatedly showing to the Jury that which has no relevancy to the issues in this case. There is no necessity for the showing in view of the testimony of this lady. We would like to make the objection together with the Zapruder film, which is State 37, the reason for these objectionable rulings of the Court and the entire record up to this point a part of the bill.
MR. ALFORD: Excuse me, please, Your Honor, because I will have to get the film.
THE COURT: Tell me when you are ready.
MR. ALFORD: One moment please, Your Honor. I would like to have Mrs. Moorman step down.
THE COURT: Yes, sir and I would like if you would get the microphone for her.
(THE ZAPRUDER FILM WAS EXHIBITED TO THE WITNESS, THE MEMBERS OF THE JURY, THE COURT, COUNSEL FOR THE DEFENSE AND COUNSEL FOR THE STATE.)
BY MR. ALFORD:
Q: Mrs. Moorman, can you locate yourself in this picture?
A: Yes.
Q: Would you please walk to the film and point to yourself.
A: (The witness complies.)
MR. ALFORD: Thank you. You may return to the witness chair.
MR. OSER: Let the record reflect Your Honor that I am returning this film to the Court.
THE COURT: Are you ready to proceed?
MR. ALFORD: The State would like to tender this witness.
MR. DYMOND: We don't have any questions of this witness, Judge.
THE COURT: Is Mrs. Moorman released from the obligations of the subpoena?
MR. ALFORD: Yes, she is.
MR. OSER: I have no questions but I wish to inform the Court at this time that the State wishes to offer, introduce, and file in evidence in view of Mrs. Moorman's testimony State Exhibit 51 and State 52.
MR. DYMOND: To which of course we object if it please the Court as there is no testimony in the record as to who took these pictures, where they came from, they are not identified to any pictures this witness took according to her own testimony and no chain has been established at all.
THE COURT: What about State 50 which you just entered and you are not offering it?
MR. ALFORD: At this time we are offering these two photographs at this time.
THE COURT: I will admit them in evidence.
MR. DYMOND: To which ruling Counsel reserves a bill of exception making State 51 and State 52 part of the bill, Counsel's objections and the ruling of the Court and the entire record parts of the bill.
MR. ALFORD: May it please the Court, because of the delicacy of State 50 and its value the State will return this to Mrs. Moorman. The State would request permission at this time to show to the Jury what has been previously marked as State 51 and State 52 as well as State 41.
THE COURT: You may show it to the Jury if it is in evidence.
MR. OSER: Your Honor, if it please the Court, as previously discussed with you the State is going to ask for a recess. We had witnesses coming in from Dallas, Texas who are not here yet and in addition there were three other witnesses who have not come and one is Officer Hargis, Mrs. Newman's husband and the third one was Mr. Holland who is in a Santa Fe hospital.
THE COURT: Also earlier you discussed with me the proposition about something that was to be done out of the presence of the Jury. Are you ready on that?
MR. OSER: Not as yet, Your Honor. This was a last minute attempt to utilize the time but unfortunately we are not in a position to get all the needed witnesses here. This would have been out of the presence of the Jury, however.
THE COURT: When do you propose to get into that feature of the case?
MR. OSER: I would think it would probably be perhaps late Monday and as I understand the Court's position is that Tuesday we are not going to work.
THE COURT: That is correct. Very well, let me explain to the Jury. Gentlemen: Unfortunately we are going to have to recess the case until Monday morning. This logistic problem you can probably understand and apparently we will not be able to proceed any further today. I will leave it up to the Sheriff to provide some type of entertainment within legal bounds. I'll try to have the Sheriff occupy your time and I know you are under a strain in trying to do your duty as a juror.
Mr. Sheriff, I would like you to take the Jury upstairs and then take them to their motel and I will communicate with Sheriff Heyd and try to come up with some idea to occupy their time this afternoon. Also I am trying to see if we have a place designated so you can see the Rex Parade and I'm trying to place you someplace where some reporters are not going to try to talk to you. If we can get some home on the Avenue and have you brought up there you might be able to view the parade on Carnival Day which may relieve the boredom or tedium you necessarily must have. Let me one more time admonish the Jury not to discuss the case until it is given to you.
Mr. Sheriff, take the Jury upstairs and we will be in recess with this case until 9:00 a.m. on Monday morning.
. . . At the hour of 11:05 o'clock a.m. the trial was recessed. . . .